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Post 120

Monday, September 12, 2005 - 8:11pmSanction this postReply
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What brings happiness if one has no values?

Post 121

Monday, September 12, 2005 - 10:20pmSanction this postReply
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Dean,-
There is no objective reason to choose to have a value.

But you can choose to have a value. If you do, you've got something to live for, and you've got morals.

 
Then why does one want "something to live for"? Why does one want "morals?" The question just hangs Dean. It dangles out there in the wind like a old pair of shoes from an overhead powerline and few ever notice and still less care to explain it, only assuming it will be gone one day of its own accord.

We accept that life is the ultimate root value from which all other branch values may be derived so it seems equally important, that is to say ultimately important, to not leave life unjustified intellectually.

Why grow the branches now the root is wither'd?
Why wither not the leaves the sap being gone?


Who can we turn to to save the day?

there is a default mode of choosing happiness over non-happiness which locks rational agents into initially choosing life

[posturing like a 600-lb silverback gorilla] 
Well whoever can produce a solution along those lines.....you'll have earned a banana. Or a leaf...or whatever the hell Dianne Fossey used to greese you monkeys up with. That's all I ever asked for, an answer like that.


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Post 122

Tuesday, September 13, 2005 - 1:26pmSanction this postReply
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Here's Rothbard on the subject:
“It may well be asked why life should be an objective ultimate value, why
man should opt for life (in duration and quality). In reply, we may note
that a proposition rises to the status of an axiom when he who denies it
may be shown to be using it in the very course of the supposed refutation.
Now, any person participating in any sort of discussion, including one on
values, is, by virtue of so participating, alive and affirming life. For if he
were really opposed to life, he would have no business in such a
discussion, indeed he would have no business continuing to be alive.
Hence, the supposed opponent of life is really affirming it in the very
process of his discussion, and hence the preservation and furtherance of
one’s life takes on the stature of an incontestable axiom.”

"It may well be asked why life should be an objective ultimate value, why
man should opt for life (in duration and quality). In reply, we may note
that a proposition rises to the status of an axiom when he who denies it
may be shown to be using it in the very course of the supposed refutation.
Now, any person participating in any sort of discussion, including one on
values, is, by virtue of so participating, alive and affirming life. For if he
were really opposed to life, he would have no business in such a
discussion, indeed he would have no business continuing to be alive.
Hence, the supposed opponent of life is really affirming it in the very
process of his discussion, and hence the preservation and furtherance of
one’s life takes on the stature of an incontestable axiom
man should opt for life (in duration and quality). In reply, we may note
that a proposition rises to the status of an axiom when he who denies it
may be shown to be using it in the very course of the supposed refutation.
Now, any person participating in any sort of discussion, including one on
values, is, by virtue of so participating, alive and affirming life. For if he
were really opposed to life, he would have no business in such a
discussion, indeed he would have no business continuing to be alive.
Hence, the supposed opponent of life is really affirming it in the very
process of his discussion, and hence the preservation and furtherance of
one’s life takes on the stature of an incontestable axiom.”
source:
www.mises.org/journals/scholar/meng.pdf
 
Ed


Post 123

Saturday, September 17, 2005 - 9:32pmSanction this postReply
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Here's Rothbard on the subject:
Yeah..right'o then. Got the jist mate, I'll hush up now.


ps Kant said this much better


Post 124

Monday, September 19, 2005 - 11:25pmSanction this postReply
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More (of the jist),

Dean, you wrote:

==============
What brings happiness if one has no values?
==============

Purely hypothetical, perhaps merely rhetorical. Show me an agent with no values (e.g. an indestructible robot?) -- and I'll show you some promising swamp land for sale in Florida.

Humans harbor the inherent value of happiness. The opposite is unthinkable.

Ed





Post 125

Tuesday, September 20, 2005 - 3:30amSanction this postReply
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There are no swamp in Florida, except perhaps the one in Gainesville for the Gators -the government has decreed it is all 'wetland', and thus protected...
(Edited by robert malcom on 9/20, 3:32am)

(Edited by robert malcom on 9/20, 3:34am)


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