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Post 20

Sunday, June 3, 2007 - 12:48pmSanction this postReply
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Michael, your posts here and especially your last response to me have been beneath even a deranged anti-Bush protestor who thinks "No blood for oil" is a cogent argument. I mentioned you in this string as being someone who might know pro-Objectivist contacts in South America. You respond with the non-sequitur that Lula is not a left wing dictator (your bete noir, no one here said it) and you preemptively expect to be called names. When you are not, you respond with imputations of lies, fantasies, and mental illness. You imply that since I am not in Vezuela, I cannot know what it's like to live there and cannot comment. Where are you now? Caracas? Please explain to me your theory of geo-epistemology, so that I may know how far I must travel to call Chavez a dictator and you an apparently self-important rude fool with a persecution complex. (If these count as names, I hope they please you. I expect from what I've heard you should find that they fit well, if not please explain why, I will be happy to be mistaken)

Ted

(Edited by Ted Keer
on 6/03, 1:56pm)


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Post 21

Sunday, June 3, 2007 - 1:12pmSanction this postReply
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Thanks again, Manfred.

Here is the beginning of the text at Manfred's first link where he says that the freedom to travel is routinely denied for political reasons. Enough people speak Spanish that I believe its meaning will be clear:

Persecusion Ideologica en Venezuela
Carta de Rocio Guijarro S. al Presidente de RELIAL

Estimado licenciado Otto Guevara:

Me dirijo a usted a fin de hacer de su conocimiento la imposibilidad que tengo de asistir a la Conferencia del Comite Ejecutivo de la Liberal Internacional (LI) y del Partido Nueva Alianza de Mexico bajo el tema Migracion: el reto del siglo XXI. Propuestas y Acciones liberales..as..como al Taller Internacional de la Red Liberal de America Latina (Relial: Gobiernos autoritarios: los casos de Bolivia, Cuba, Nicaragua y Venezuela, a celebrarse en la ciudad de Cancun Mexico del 28 de Abril al 2 de Mayo 2007.


(I write to explain that I will be unable to attend the conference.)

El gobierno venezolano tiene sobre ciudadanos que no comparten sus ideas socialistas y que defienden a capa y espada las ideas liberales, una sistematica y ostensible persecucion, persecucion que incluye descalificacion moral, amenazas fisicas y acusaciones penales. Entre esos ciudadanos esta mi persona y la institucion que tengo a bien ser su gerente general.


(The Venezuelan government systematically perscutes citizens who do not comport with its socialist ideals through fines and other penalties.)

Estas acusaciones penales por defender la libertad y por tener programas y proyectos con apoyo de fundaciones de USA, son dos juicios politicos que me siguen y por ello tengo una orden de prohibicion de salida del pais desde el año 2004. El Tribunal a cargo me ha otorgado permisos de salida en varias oportunidades a sabiendas de que al regresar del viaje debo presentarme para que sepan que no he huido. Para este viaje a Mexico a los eventos arriba mencionados y asi se lo habia informado al señor Victor Becerra, me dieron el permiso hace do s semanas. Sin embargo el dia de hoy 27 de Abril, me informaron los abogados que el Tribunal sin explicacion alguna lo habia revocado, por lo que no puedo salir del pais, lo que lamento profundamente.


The point: Rocio Guijarro is being persecuted by the Venezuelan state as a defender of liberal principles. She is writing to inform the liberal organization RELIAL that she has been under an order of prohibition from leaving the country since 2004, and that as of April 27 her lawyers have advised her that a conditional pass that had been granted to attend the RELIAL conference in Mexico has been revoked without explanation, and therefore she regrets that she cannot attend.

Censorship √
Political Imprisonment √
Closed Borders √
_________________

Dictatorship √

Ted Keer

(given the character errors, I have overtyped some of the accented vowels without accents.)
(Edited by Ted Keer
on 6/03, 1:53pm)


Post 22

Sunday, June 3, 2007 - 4:15pmSanction this postReply
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Ted,

Please read correctly. Believe me, you have not been reading carefully on this issue. Here's the last one. You just wrote in Post 20:

"You respond with the non-sequitur that Lula is not a left wing dictator (your bete noir, no one here said it)..."

Now please read Post 5 above from Manfred (which I sanctioned):

"The �many countries in Latin America that are ruled by leftist dictators now� include, of course, Fidel Castro of Cuba, to whom you can add: Chaves of Venezuela, Kirchner, a follower of Chavez, of Argentina (where I was born), Lula of Brazil and Evo Morales, another Chavista, of Bolivia."

Thanks.

If you wonder what's bothering me about you, it's your sloppiness about things South American. You talk big and get too much wrong for my taste.

All they get is a pat on the head,
Then it's time to go to bed.


That's the way Americans (the sympathetic ones) have always treated South America, while they turned a blind eye to the real problems and the monkey-business from the bad Americans (the ones in bed with the local governments). Don't expect applause from me for that. Better yet, see if you find a soul brother with this dude on another forum here (who feels just as vocally self-righteous without doing anything as you do), and I quote:

"Or perhaps you've been translating The Communist Manifesto into Portuguese for the local Venezuelan mestizos?"

OK. You are careless as all get out, but even you know that they don't speak Portuguese in Venezuela.

Michael

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Post 23

Sunday, June 3, 2007 - 6:24pmSanction this postReply
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Either/Or


Is "talk big" an insult or a compliment? Are you telling me you are intimidated by my style? Or to put up my dukes?

I'm not interested in what some fool on another forum said about the national language of Venezuela that annoyed you. If you want to list non-sequiturs, why not bring up the fact that President Ford denied that Poland was under Soviet domination in his debate with Carter during the '76 election? What kind of epistemology is this?

Patronize, obfuscate, whine, play the victim, change the subject, complain about my "big talk" all you want, your focus on irrelevant minutiae and your evasion of direct questions about your sympathies for Chavez speak for themselves.

Either Chavez is a dictator or he isn't.

And you know it.

Ted

Post 24

Monday, June 4, 2007 - 5:25pmSanction this postReply
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The Revolution will be Televised?

(Edited by Ted Keer
on 6/04, 8:29pm)


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Post 25

Monday, June 4, 2007 - 8:36pmSanction this postReply
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Who's Crying Now?


On Sunday, the largest spontaneous and (according to Adam Housely of Fox News on Monday's Special Report) totally unplanned protest march yet occurred, consisting not of students, (a.k.a. American dupes) but of people of all ages and classes, of black, white and indigenous backgrounds.

Meanwhile, against all "educated" prediction, anti-Chavez protests continue in the streets of Venezuela. At the present OAS Conference, Secretary of State Rice has expressed support for the demonstrators, the Venezuelan representative has threatened to withdraw from the Organization of American States.

The Venezuelan Foreign Minister has offered to consider restoring RCTV to the air - after the US releases all its prisoners at Guantanamo.

Chavez has personally announced that he will shut down any opposition outlet that challenges him, whether or not he has the pretense of a licensing issue.

The concern of the Venezuelan regime for the down-trodden is truly moving.

Ted Keer

Post 26

Tuesday, June 5, 2007 - 12:31pmSanction this postReply
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Hey, perfect opportunity.  Just release all the Guantanamo prisoners right into Venezuela!

Post 27

Tuesday, June 5, 2007 - 2:27pmSanction this postReply
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I had the exact same thought, Laure, but it's not like Chavez would keep them there. Of course, being me, I then thought we could release them, from a height.

Ted

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Post 28

Tuesday, June 5, 2007 - 7:36pmSanction this postReply
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Just wanted to let people know that some of MSK's posts have been removed. He's been on "moderated" status for some time because of his belligerence whenever anyone questions his idiocy. I've deleted the posts that I saw in the queue that were just insults or his usual attempts at one-upping people. So if you're wondering why it went silent, it's because he had nothing but insults left to say.

I've also decided to go ahead and throw him in the Dissenter category, for reasons that should be obvious to most people.

Post 29

Sunday, June 10, 2007 - 1:35pmSanction this postReply
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Here are some more recent links and comments about the takeover of the Venezuelan free press by the Chavistas.

Ted

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