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Post 60

Tuesday, May 2, 2006 - 7:42amSanction this postReply
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Has anyone considered Leonard Peikov as Eddie Willers, Alan Greenspan as Wesley Mooch, and Linz as Bertram Scudder.

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Post 61

Tuesday, May 2, 2006 - 9:07amSanction this postReply
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I've added representative photo links to all my casting suggestions, plus some new recommendations, on this blog entry.

Now you can SEE what I mean.


Post 62

Tuesday, May 2, 2006 - 2:29pmSanction this postReply
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I still disagree with your Pitt casting choice. Mainly due to Fight Club...

He pulled off the charismatic leader thing quite effectivly there (nihilist or not)

But basically what I'm asking is


       Picture of Paul Bettany


Which man looks delicate enough to play Ragnar?

---Landon


Post 63

Tuesday, May 2, 2006 - 3:59pmSanction this postReply
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Delicate? Ragnar?

The guy who comes swinging in the window at the climax, in a shower of broken glass, guns blazing?

Rand describes a "tall, slim figure, with the windbreaker stressing its trained muscular agility..." (Part II, Ch. 7, "The Moratorium on Brains.")

I'd look at those two body types above and say, "That's Brad Pitt."


Post 64

Tuesday, May 2, 2006 - 7:19pmSanction this postReply
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Peter,

Good call. I've never seen those before, but the style is awesome, and completely _Atlas_.

-Bill

Post 65

Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 2:42pmSanction this postReply
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I still think bettany has the underlying intensity but Ragnar always seemed described as deceptively intense. Everyone always seemed to think he was going to break or get sick until they remembered he was a pirate.

---Landon


Post 66

Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 3:07pmSanction this postReply
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I don't think fragility or delicacy was the concern.

In the valley, when Dagny sees him for the first time approaching the house he is "a swift, agile figure that leaped over boulders with the casual ease of a flight." Before she knows who he is, she thinks that "any work seemed too dangerous for his incredible kind of beauty." Then she's horrified to learn that he's Ragnar, immediately fearing for his life.

I sense an Errol Flynn kind of figure, but even better looking. There's no delicacy there, just stunning physical perfection.



(Edited by Robert Bidinotto
on 5/03, 3:08pm)


Post 67

Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 3:21pmSanction this postReply
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Arrrgh, I give up. Just throw all the hotties in one room and I don't care who play whom anymore, Galt, Ragnar, Francisco, all fine with me. ;-)

(Ooops, wrong forum.)

(Edited by Hong Zhang on 5/03, 4:06pm)


Post 68

Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 6:07pmSanction this postReply
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Robert wrote,
Delicate? Ragnar?

The guy who comes swinging in the window at the climax, in a shower of broken glass, guns blazing?

Rand describes a "tall, slim figure, with the windbreaker stressing its trained muscular agility..." (Part II, Ch. 7, "The Moratorium on Brains.")
If I recall Rand's description of Ragnar as Rearden's bodyguard, she describes him as a giant. When I was in Reykjavik, Iceland last year, I saw someone who fit Rand's description. The guy was a guard at the Hotel Nordica. I thought it was a gigantic statue, until he moved. Then I did a double take. The guy was at least 7' 5", much taller than any basketball player I've seen, some of whom have been close to 7 feet. But someone that tall wouldn't be as agile as Rand describes Danneskjold, although he was definitely taller than Rearden, who was described as being pretty tall himself. I don't know any Hollywood actor fit to play this Viking giant, except maybe Swedish actor Dolph Lundgren, who is 6'5".

- Bill



Post 69

Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 6:17pmSanction this postReply
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"If Taggert Dies.. He dies"

Between that and the Punisher I would not want to see Lundgren anywhere near the studio where this is filmed.

Fun fact the company making the film recently did a new Punisher movie (based on the Marvel comic) Lundgren starred in an unbelievably horrible Punisher film in 1989 made by an austrailian company.

My GOD that movie was bad! And yet I own it.

Punisher 1989 MP B Poster Dolph Lundgren

Ok the worst part is I think I can see it visually but he does NOT have the acting range for this movie.

---Landon


Post 70

Wednesday, May 3, 2006 - 10:39pmSanction this postReply
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I agree with Robert that Francisco is the hardest to cast.  He has the rare combination (on-screen) of a penetrating intelligence coupled with a high capacity for a joy in living.  I disagree that Christian Bale would fit the role of Francisco, I wasn't impressed with him in Batman.  He's too stone-faced, he doesn't have a strong emotive presence.  I do have a couple of "sleeper" picks for the role of Francisco.

Eric Bana--I thought he out-shined Pitt in Troy by a long shot.  One part in particular, Hector (in the myth) knows he's going to die in the Trojan War.  Achilles is hell-bent on revenge for the killing of his cousin, and at that point in the movie, Bana does not show an ounce of fear in facing the near-invincible Achilles.  He makes all the necessary preparations for his family and for battle, without the slightest hint of hesitation in his face--knowing full-well that this is his end.  In Munich, he would have been great as the avenger of the slain, except the writing and storyline turned him morally ambiguous--a shame.

Jim Caviezel--Forget Passion of the Christ--loathsome movie.  He was great in The Counte of Monte Cristo.  His range of character was astounding--going from a naive, gullible victim to a cold and calculating avenger to a compassionate victor.  Very good performance.

I also have a hesitant pick for Dagy, another tough character to cast.  I think this picture of Claire Danes captures Dagny:

http://www.imdb.com/gallery/granitz/3896/Events/3896/ClaireDane_Devan_6594933_400.jpg?path=pgallery&path_key=Danes,%20Claire

The problem is that she is very soft on film, I am not sure she could rise to the occasion of playing a "calculating machine".  She's probably not shrewd enough, but she would definitely capture the vulnerability.

Russell Crowe would be good for Galt, but I think his is more suited to play Rearden.  He's much better in the tougher roles as evidenced by Gladiator and Proof of Life.  Plus, I can't see him pulling off Galt's speech, he's probably not intellectual enough.

I think Ed Norton is a good actor, but not suited for a part as a hero.  After watching Rounders, I think he would be good as Phillip Reardon.  He did well in the underhanded weasel role.

Phillip Seymour Hoffman--can't you just see this guy whining about "how he couldn't help it" and it was the result of forces beyond his control?  Good fit for Orren Boyle.  Good range of character, could also pull of Wesley Mouch quite easily.

For Robert Stadler, I like Stellan Skarsgard (aka Professor Gerald Lambeau in Good Will Hunting).  Did a great job as the arrogant, condescending professor attuned only to his private academic world.  Not a large step to pull off Stadler.

I also think Keifer Sutherland is more suited to Ragnar.  He may not have the size or the flawless good looks, but as the avenging pirate?  Can anybody doubt this after 24?

Gabrielle Byrne I think he would work as Ellis Wyatt--understated but able to turn up the heat when necessary (see Usual Suspects).

Geoffrey Rush also has a good range of character.  I think he could play a number of the villains, but might work as the arrogant and smarmy Bertram Scudder.

I went through this process a few years back thinking about who would be good for each character.  I had more, but these are the ones off the top of my head.  If I can remember more I will post them.

(Edited by Michael Moeller on 5/04, 8:33am)

(Edited by Michael Moeller on 5/04, 8:35am)


Post 71

Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 8:19amSanction this postReply
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Bill (post 68): No, the recollection isn't accurate. Ragnar wasn't huge. At all. Certainly not a giant! Tall, slim, blond, with "trained muscular agility," bounding lightly over rocks -- and with a Viking-godlike face of stunning physical perfection. That's Rand's description.

Lundgren is a Neanderthal by contrast. He is also decades too old. And Dolph Lundgren...as a cerebral philosophy student?

Again, it's quite interesting what people bring away from their readings of the books. I don't mean this to single you out in this regard, Bill. I mean it generally. Over the decades, the actors I've heard suggested by fans of Rand's novels for film versions often bear very little physical or even psychological resemblance to the descriptions put down on paper by the author.

That's understandable. We bring our own template of experiences and emotions with us when we sit down in a chair to read a book. Invariably, as we read, we try to associate and relate the sketchy characterizations on the page to images already firmly planted in our heads. Within a few pages of the original description, we've suddenly transplanted our own vision onto the characters. Suddenly the blond, blue-eyed, conflicted Hank Rearden, "too tall for those around him," with a coldly chiseled, unpretty-but-masculine face, age about 46, becomes in some minds a dark Tom Selleck, or a too-pretty Brad Pitt, instead of a tall, unpretty, anguished-looking-but-masculine Liam Neeson.

This is why translating books to film is an inherently dangerous enterprise. You are always going to thwart some fans' expectations. The best that a production team can do is to treat the source as their bible, and try to fit their choices as closely as possible to what's on the printed page.

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Post 72

Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 3:50pmSanction this postReply
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Robert,

I think you make some good points here, but I have to disagree with part.  I think you place too much of an emphasis on physical resemblance with the characters in the book.  Ideally, one would like the actor to resemble the physical appearance AND the psychological nature of the character.  But in a choice between the two, I think you have to go with essential characteristics of the character, which is primarily their mental functioning.  The best way to judge this is by what they have projected on-screen in the roles they have taken.  Some of your choices seem to focus to much on physical resemblance.  After all, its not the physical appearance that differentiates the characters, it is the way they approach reality.  I mean, what is essential about Francisco, the fact that he had dark, swept hair and blue eyes or his capacity for life?

Take, for instance, Christian Bale.  Judged from his roles, can he pull off the high capacity of a joy in living embodied by Francisco?  Does he project a penetrating intelligence?  I have a difficult time projecting him pulling this off.  (Besides, I don't think he matches Francisco physically either.  He's too boyish and unrefined to play an aristocrat.  I don't think he looks Latin either, not even in the Roman sense ).

Another of your choices is Gandolfini for Orren Boyle.  Again, I experience a disconnect in trying to projection him as Boyle from the roles he has taken.  He's probably more appropriate for Cuffy Meigs.  Physically, all I remember about Boyle is that he was big and had black slits for eyes.  But what is essential about Boyle?  It is his constant excuse-making--the "I couldn't help it" mentality.  Gandolfini is too gruff to project that kind of helplessness.  Now Phillip Seymour Hoffman, on the other hand, I think could pull it off quite nicely.

Another example is Lovitz as Bertram Scudder.  He's too cartoonish, too goofy.  Scudder is a grandstanding pseudo-intellectual who uses all sorts of sophism to promote the worst ideas.  Can Lovitz project this?  I think somebody like Geoffrey Rush is more suited because he has much more of a pseudo-intellectual presence, even though he doesn't have the "softness" from what I remember in Scudder's description.

Whether a character is not as pretty or ugly enough, or the right hair color or the right height or the right age--I don't think should discount them from the role (except for a few of the characters like Francisco).  What I did is examined what the character projected on-screen to see if it matched the essential characteristics/attitude of the character, physical appearance was more secondary to me--as I think it should be.  After all, Lundgen doesn't match Ragnar physically, but what is worse is a "Neanderthal" brute trying to project a philosophy student, a man of mind.

BTW, what do you think of Eric Bana as Francisco?  At first I had mixed feelings, but the more I think about it, the more I  like it.

Regards,
Michael

(Edited by Michael Moeller on 5/04, 3:52pm)


Post 73

Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 5:15pmSanction this postReply
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Michael, we don't really disagree on the primary importance of an actor's ability to project the appropriate psychology and character for a role. In the case of a landmark novel with culturally iconic characters, however, I do think that the major roles, at least, should be cast with actors who also bear a fairly close physical resemblance to the descriptions in the source book.

You can get more creative with the secondary and tertiary roles -- for example, my suggesting a black Morgan Freeman as Hugh Akston. There, I went solely for the psychological essence of the character, rather than for a physical type, because the former is the only thing truly important about the Akston character.

But for Galt, Dagny, Francisco, Ragnar, and Rearden? No, I don't think just going for a psychological type is sufficient. For those beloved characters, Rand's physical descriptions are embedded in millions of minds; and the casting people just can't afford to thwart fan expectations by picking actors whose look strays very far from what is in the novel.

Imagine casting in "Gone With the Wind" Errol Flynn as Rhett Butler, for example. Yes, he was as dashing and cocky as Gable; but he didn't have quite the "look" of the character in the book. As a result, it just would not have been the same film, and millions of the book's fans would have been upset.

Interestingly, I suspect that of the major parts in Atlas, you probably have more latitude casting John Galt than any of the other heroes. The two main reasons are that he spends far less time "on stage" in the novel than do Francisco and Rearden, and -- IMHO -- his physical description never concretizes for the reader as vividly as theirs do.

For most of the novel, Galt is a shadow on the sidewalk, a voice on the radio, an unseen sounding board for Eddie Willers. He is a ghost, an archetype, a legend. When he finally appears, as Dagny opens her eyes in the valley, Rand gives us a very, very long description freighted with many evaluative abstractions about pride and arrogance and intelligence, etc. -- so many details and editorial comments, in fact, that I as a reader experience a "crow epistemology" problem: my mind is overwhelmed with too much to absorb in order to successfully visualize the essence of his appearance. Rand's best stylization of Galt concerns his distinctive manner of speaking. But overall, I think Rand portrays his intellect much better than she does his physical appearance, which just doesn't gel for me as successfully as does Francisco's or Rearden's, whom she described in bold, essential strokes. Many other readers -- especially women -- have told me the same thing over the years: for them, Galt is more mind than body.

That's why in suggesting Russell Crowe for that role, I went mainly for an actor of the appropriate age who could convincingly project great intelligence, and strong, masculine leadership qualities. I asked myself: Who plausibly could be cast against a Liam Neeson and a Christian Bale as their leader, and also romantic competitor for Dagny? Face it, the Hollywood pickin's are slim. I'm convinced Crowe has the screen presence and other qualities to pull it off.

All of this is moot, of course, if "Brangelina" want the Galt-Dagny parts. They are just too big in the business to say "no" to. To say that these roles would be a stretch for either actor is a huge understatement. But in some films they have displayed more talent and range than either their public images or glitzier screen roles suggest.

We could do worse.



Post 74

Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 6:16pmSanction this postReply
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Robert,

On how to choose who would be ideal for a part, we agree.  I was just pointing out that your picks were more prioritized in terms of physical appearance as opposed to whether they would fit the essential character elements (judging from the actors' roles on film).  Perhaps our priorities in picking are a little different.  For instance, would you rather have a Francisco that fit his physical description perfectly but didn't quite capture the high capacity for a joy in exercising his abilities--or would you rather have a Francisco that didn't quite match the physical description but nailed his lust for life?  I would definitely choose the latter.

I agree with you on Russell Crowe and Galt.  Although, minus the age and physical appearance, he might be more suited for Rearden.  Either way, in playing the hero, I think Crowe is without peer.  I mean, just look at the roles he has racked up--Gladiator, Proof of Life (very underrated movie), Master and Commander, Cindarella Man, even movies I liked less such as L.A Confidential and A Beautiful Mind he was great.  Immense talent.  Incidentally, when he won Best Actor, paraphrasing the end of his speech he held up the Oscar and said that: "to all the actors out there struggling, know that this is possible"--I thought that was inspirational.  Also, very unexpected considering he throws telephones at bellhops.

Brangelina isn't the greatest option, but you're right, there could be worse (Susan Sarandon as Dagny!!).  Its hard to judge if the acting talent pool in Hollywood is really that thin.  The problem is is that the writing and plots are so bad that actors really never get a chance to shine.  It really is a shame considering the potential for inspiration that movies hold.

You didn't answer my question!!  What do you think of Eric Bana for Francisco?  He has the aristocratic look and, to a degree, the Latin look in the Roman sense.  Also, his fearlessness in Troy sold me, he's got serious acting chops.

Regards,
Michael

(Edited by Michael Moeller on 5/04, 6:20pm)

(Edited by Michael Moeller on 5/04, 6:37pm)


Post 75

Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 6:59pmSanction this postReply
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I love Eric Bana. Saw him in Munich. Great bod. 6'3", Right age (38).

I've only seen Christian Bale in "Velvet Goldmine". (Hehehe). Besides, he's a bit young, only 32.

But, I still think Hugh Jackman would beat both as the multi-faced Francisco - young tycoon, playboy, philosopher, passionate and jealous lover...and, boy, how he can sing! Did somebody mention a musical AS?!

(Edited by Hong Zhang on 5/04, 8:50pm)


Post 76

Thursday, May 4, 2006 - 8:19pmSanction this postReply
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Michael:

Eric Bana...only recall seeing him in "Troy," and I really don't remember him well. He may be fine, but I'm afraid I'm just not familiar enough with his work to cast a vote.

Glad we agree on Crowe. He is an amazing actor, regardless of whether he is a stellar human being. Incredibly, I'd forgotten "Cinderella Man," which I loved. There he played, with heart-breaking poignancy and dignity, a much simpler, blue-collar guy. His "aging" at the end of "A Beautiful Mind" was astonishing. His power and presence in "Master and Commander" and "Gladiator" were magnificent. The guy can do anything. I think he may be the only actor alive who could convincingly portray Galt, then go back to the makeup trailer, and come out ready to portray Rearden, too!

Hong:

"Atlas...The Musical!" Hahahaha. Your loyalty to Mr. Jackman is charming. I do like him an awful lot. But I don't think you could possibly judge Christian Bale's comparable suitability until you see "Batman Begins," which is a wonderful film in every way -- and a total surprise for anyone who thinks, "Aw, I don't wanna see another comic book onscreen." It's much more than that, and Bale is a revelation.

Finally, I just had the opportunity tonight of reconsidering Ashley Judd as a possible Dagny, after seeing her in "Twisted," where she portrays a tough, sexy, but conflicted detective. Wow. I've bounced back and forth for years about who could pull off Dagny the best, and as mentioned above, my most recent choice was Nicole Kidman. But Judd's intelligence, acting ability, emotional range, and ability to project toughness as well as sexiness are pulling her back into first place for me. She appears to have the whole package. She also looks closer to Rand's description, I think, than Kidman.

Maybe I should have paid more attention to producer Al Ruddy a few years ago, when we met at his L.A. office concerning his (ultimately abortive) efforts to make the "Atlas" movie. He raved to me about Ashley Judd being his choice for Dagny. He also said that she was a fan of the novel and wanted the part...though I don't know if this last was simply Hollywood Producer B.S.

But upon reconsideration, I really think she could do it. She certainly projects all the essential qualities, maybe even better than Kidman or Blanchett, my other preferences. There's also this basic screen test:

Which of those actresses could you most plausibly imagine three extraordinary men competing for?

I think I'd have to give Ashley the edge.

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