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Friday, March 11, 2005 - 8:13pmSanction this postReply
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This is exceptionally good news.  It's crucially important for Muslims to take up the cause of liberty and to confront the fanatical terrorists in their midsts.  Just as Jews and Christians had to acknowledge the moral goodness of liberty and toleration, Muslims must take this step.  It's also important for the rest of us to remember that far more Muslims have been murdered by the fanatical Islamists than have been Christians, Jews, Hindus, Atheists, or members of any other religion (or non-religion). 

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Post 1

Friday, March 11, 2005 - 10:39pmSanction this postReply
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While we're on the subject of Islamic terrorists, check out this hilarious spoof of Frank Sinatra's Strangers in the Night:

http://www.beecy.net/frank/

The Sinatra impersonation is uncanny - right down to the singer's trademark off-key notes. But it's the new lyrics I love - they express exactly how defiant old Frankie would have responded to 9/11:

Strangers on my flight,
turbans they're packin'.
Wonderin' if they might,
plan a hijacking.
They could pull a stunt,
before this flight is through.

Something's on their minds.
I saw them mutter.
What that in their hands?
Looks like box cutters,
I'm gonna kick some ass,
if they make a move.

Strangers on my flight.
Two smelly people,
and they're not talking right;
and in a moment,
I will grab base ball bat;
and that will be that.
Swing like Joe DiMaggio,
and rip them both a new a-hole.

And if they pick a fight,
and try to screw us,
I'll punch out their lights,
just like Joe Louis.
It would feel so right,
for strangers on my flight.

Ratta Tat Tat Tat,
Budda Bing Bang Boom,
Zooma Zooma Zoom.

Send those bastards to the moon....

Enjoy! (And Linz: I hope your system can play this gem :))

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Saturday, March 12, 2005 - 5:06amSanction this postReply
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It is possible that this is good news. However, let’s consider the other possibilities.

 

1. This cleric is in Spain (or occupied Andalusia as Islamists think of it). The rules of a Muslim living in a non-Muslim-ruled land are very different. Mohammad’s life illustrates how to behave. In the first half of his religious career, he was in Mecca trying to preach his religion in a hostile setting. During this period he talked about tolerance. During his second period, in Medina, he became repressive, bellicose, and strident as time progressed. Dissenters were silenced by death. Medina, a town originally founded by Jews, had an agricultural economy. Unwilling to do honest work, he plundered the caravans traveling to Mecca even the in holy month (if it’s for Islam, exceptions are allowed). He ethnically cleansed Medina of Jews and established a totalitarian type rule with imperialist aims. In less that a century, his follows conquered most of what was believed to be the world.

 

It is proper for a Muslim to use lies and deception in the cause of advancing Islam (a doctrine called taqqiya). Can we believe this fatwa or is it tactical? If this fatwa was issued by leading clerics in Islamic countries it would be far more significant – especially if issued simultaneously by religious leaders in several countries. The doctrine of ijma holds that a consensus of learned leaders of the community (ummah) will never be wrong.

 

2. Bin Laden is no Mohammad. After 9/11 there were street rallies for bin Laden in several Islamic countries. However, after he and his cronies were routed from Afghanistan in weeks, these rallies ceased. His actions have caused the loss of two major territories to American hegemony. He has since to regain power or execute another major terrorist attack against America.

 

Let’s remember, Mohammad wasn’t the guy who died on a cross but a warrior who conquered Arabia and left a military to conquer what seemed like the world. Muslims don’t like losers. Jesus never ruled and his followers lived in persecution during the 1st three hundred years of Christianity. During Islam’s 1400 years Christians lived in oppression as second class citizens groveling for favors from Muslims. Now bin Laden is on the run living in caves like the early Christians. What could more humiliating?

 

Thus, maybe the fatwa is real – not because of a change of heart or moderation among Muslims – but because bin Laden is a loser.

 

I give just two possibilities for your consideration. I could give many more. We won’t know until there is a pattern of such rulings – in Islamic countries.

(Edited by Jason Pappas on 3/12, 5:23am)


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Saturday, March 12, 2005 - 8:25pmSanction this postReply
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I take this news with cautious optimism, and I think Jason's post clarifies why I use the word 'cautious'.  My own suspicion is that real positive change in the Middle East, if it is to happen, will take place in the form of a reformed version of Islam that draws a line in the sand with the hardliners.  The two factions may have to have a violent conflict in some way.  A more secular, tolerant version of Islam would then appear, and the condition of the Muslim would (hopefully) improve to the point where the radicals will be marginalized. 

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Monday, March 14, 2005 - 12:11amSanction this postReply
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Good news if the whole fatwa thing was ever good news.

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Post 5

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 1:06amSanction this postReply
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I don't know what is in the water that Spaniards drink over there, but the world sure could use a little of it sometimes.

Everybody knew about Chile's Pinochet. Old news. South America. Who cared? Nobody did much. Well a Spaniard sure put a bug up his trousers for a while.

When the most important thing in the world right now in terms of Bin Laden is to remove him as a heroic role model (just like Saddam was) for Arabs so the madness can start to heal, Spaniards step up again and denounce him from the very religion he proclaims to promote.

I say bravo to Spain. It is not an Islamic country but it is a start. Big trees grow from small acorns.

Michael


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Monday, March 14, 2005 - 1:07pmSanction this postReply
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Michael,

Thanks for your compliment, but we sure to hell don't deserve it. If you are referring to the Spain that I live in and am shortly to become a citizen of, then this news is an exception not the norm. My "fellow countrymen" are cowardly, antiwar, anti-American, anti-capitalist hedonists whose only salvation is their gorgeous women, excellent red wine, sensational hams and incredible sense of life.... hmmm, think I'll stay here a little longer :-).

David

Honorary Spaniard, author of this article that you must read before judging the Spaniards!

And this one too!

All this self promotion... wonder if I should start a blog...?


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Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 1:14amSanction this postReply
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I had two cups of coffee, so I should be awake now. I read this and I think I'm still dreaming.

To my experience, opinions where such in old Europe: entire generation of students and left wing sympathisers supported the Palestinian cause, integration of moslim immigrants in our society and not buying Israeli products.  

Then 9/11 happened. This act was condemned everywhere, but in Palestina they where dancing in the street. The reaction of European muslims was something like "we are the good muslims, we are not like this 1% extremists, please don't take out your anger on us, please, please understand Islam, please, please..." It never occured to them to condemn these crimes or to have a long hard look at their belief system. This is the first time so called moderate muslims condemn islamic crimes.

Now all we have to do is convince the other Europeans terrorism is an attack on basic values of a free soceity and not that "we had it coming, with our bad foreign policy in the Middle East and all that".


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