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Monday, March 14, 2005 - 2:41amSanction this postReply
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I'm a new member here.  For years I was a Christian.  Then a Christian minister.  Then I lost my faith and became a mystic. 

I'm now an objectivist and proud atheist.

But, as a professional writer, I produced a lot of work in my mystic / Christian days which I am now embarrassed about.  I can't recall the work because it's already out there, with my name on it. 

So how should I view it?  As the folly of youth?  Or as something which I need to compensate for in some way?

Should an objectivist ever feel a need to repent?


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Monday, March 14, 2005 - 10:56amSanction this postReply
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Ian,

First, welcome aboard. I mean here, at this site -- not into any "movement." That would be a bit cultist. Yours was apparently a journey of self-discovery and learning, not a search for a new "ism" to which to "belong."

And that's how you should view your past.

One thing can be said with certainty about The Past: everybody has one. We were all different then than we are now. We grow. As we learn and evolve, we are not the same people we once were.

We also encounter truths in different ways, at different times. We should not feel ashamed of the fact that we all once accepted views that we later came to regard as mistaken. To do that is to tacitly expect that we "somehow" should have known better. But that is to expect that we should been born omniscient.

Don't accept the unearned guilt of judging yourself by an impossible standard. You didn't know what you didn't know. You learned better, and when you did, you changed your mind.

If you had done some terrible harm to someone, perhaps you would properly feel the need to atone for the damage done. But unless that's the case -- if instead you were simply your own victim -- then you have done nothing to feel penitent about.

Rather than feel guilty about your past views, you should credit yourself for the honesty and courage to confront them and change them as needed. You have done something to feel proud of. You were ready and willing to follow your independent rational judgment wherever your mind took you. Not everyone is willing to do that.

Keep learning, keep growing, keep being willing to change in the face of new knowledge. And as a rule, don't waste time looking back. The only thing you can control is "now." If you must look back at the past, seek from it useful life lessons, not paralyzing feelings of guilt.

I don't mean to sound preachy, but these lessons were difficult for me to learn. If by sharing them I can spare someone some time otherwise wasted, then even my past mistakes may serve a useful purpose.

Good wishes to you.


Post 2

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 11:21amSanction this postReply
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Excellent response Robert.  Nothing to add except thank you for taking the time to write it.  I'm sure there are many who could use it.

Jason


Post 3

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 11:53amSanction this postReply
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Ian: I applaud your concern with doing what is right. Too many people are willing to shrug off what they had done in the past, who don't take ideas or morality seriously. Yes everyone has a past, but some should be ashamed of theirs and some shouldn't. Some need to make amends for things they had done and some don't.

I can't answer for you what specific course you need to take. On the general question, of course an Objectivist should repent, if that means making up for wrong-doing and taking the personal steps necessary to avoid repeating the same kind of evil. For your case I don't know what making amends would entail. Probably it would include telling some who knew you as a minister the truth. Certainly you want to be on the watch for making the same kinds of errors you made in the past. Of crucial importance in that quest is actively changing your epistemology and psycho-epistemology.

Accepting earned guilt implies that you take the concept of justice seriously, but for the range of wrongs you had done, the primary long-term focus should be on improving yourself, on striving to be better, not out of guilt, but out of a desire to achieve the best that you can for yourself.

"The purpose of morality is to teach you, not to suffer and die, but to enjoy yourself and live" -- Ayn Rand


Post 4

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 12:06pmSanction this postReply
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Ian,
The best ammend you could make is to yourself in the life you lead TODAY.

Get out there and flourish!

John

Post 5

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 12:38pmSanction this postReply
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Hi Ian,

I find it impossible to improve upon the excellent advice of the above posters, especially Robert. (Did you ever think of doing a blog, Mr. Bidinotto? If so, you should consider including links in your posts. Or we'd never know!).

With regards to articles that are out there- there is only one person whose opinion on these ultimately matters- and that is you. And seeing as you appear to have seen the light of reason, amen, case closed.

It would be a nice touch, however, to be able to email owners of all sites (hell, I just assumed all writing was on the internet... am I THAT young :) ?) with a notice requesting that they place a disclaimer after your writing. Something like, "author repents. No longer believes in the nonexistent. Find out more at SoloHQ."

Well, congratulations on your brave acceptance of the glorious facts of reality.

David


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Monday, March 14, 2005 - 12:56pmSanction this postReply
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Ian,

Thank you for posting that and welcome. I'm sort of new around here too.

I have a question. What the hell`s wrong with being the author of your previous work? I think you should be proud of it. From you post, you are obviously a good writer who can state ideas clearly and dramatically.

My suggestion would be to write some kind of essay publicly stating your change in thinking and why. Then whenever needed,  point to your work as "before then" and "after then."

As to sorting it all out in your head, Robert's post is right on target.

There is a very good book on making the transformation from Christianity, Dare to Think for Yourself, by Betty J. Brogaard (although it is not Objectivist, per se). I read it online while it was available. Now you have to buy the book. Amazing how she simplifies understanding the Bible from a rational viewpoint. Here is a comment from the blurb:

Dare To Think For Yourself : An inspiring new book by American writer Betty J. Brogaard recounting her personal journey from unquestioning religious faith to a lifestance of rational inquiry and a naturalistic view of the world. 

There is also very interesting work by a Canadian, Earl Doherty, on the rational evidence of the very existence of Jesus as a man, which he painstakingly demonstrates that there is none. Impeccable scholarship on early Christian and non-Christian writings. You can take a look-see at www.jesuspuzzle.org.

At the risk of being trounced around here, I don't find the Bible to be such a bad book, but I don't take it to be divinely inspired either. I spent a lot of time reading it and some of the things in there have prompted me to think and grow. I only mention this because you must have spent many long hours of your life reading it also - and now you might have a tendency to condemn the whole kit and caboodle - both good and bad.

The beautiful thing about rational truth to me (is there really any other kind?) is that you can find it anywhere and everywhere - even there. Truth has no owner but your own self when you find it. But nothing in my life has topped the "religious" experience of reading Atlas Shrugged for the first time.

Welcome aboard.

Edit add-on - There is another very good site on uniting all aspects, good and bad, of Objectivism: www.noblesoul.com. If you look there carefully, you can find The Jesus Puzzle mentioned, but that is not where I came across Doherty's work. I stumbled on it researching responses to a Christian (and dear friend) who was trying to save my soul.

Michael

(Edited by Michael Stuart Kelly on 3/14, 1:08pm)


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Post 7

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 4:05pmSanction this postReply
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Robert, I'd like to echo every word of your advice to Ian. Your story is also mine. And I, too, would say: ". . . these lessons were difficult for me to learn. If by sharing them I can spare someone some time otherwise wasted, then even my past mistakes may serve a useful purpose."

Barbara


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Post 8

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 6:06pmSanction this postReply
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Ian Bruce wrote: "Should an objectivist ever feel a need to repent?"

I often repent for being an Objectivist.  I don't know what I am doing, but I don't know how to stop.  It started in high school when I had an independent thought and it felt good and a few years later I had another... and by the time I was 35 or so, it was pretty much an ingrained habit that became part of family life.  I let my daughter think for herself and you can read about that in Parenting.  Hong Zhang questioned my sanity.  I never question my sanity, but I do question not questioning it.  I had a rough couple of days back in 1984 when I saw Brain Storm and then a few years ago when I saw The Matrix.  Ayn Rand never addressed the issue of why food that doesn't taste like anything always tastes like chicken.  You have to wonder.

I used to be an atheist and I still am.  The non-existent middle ground  is that I think in terms of galactic teenagers who messed with our planet and took off before The Old Man found out and raised Hell with them over it.  I mean, we know for a fact that you can take a million generations of mice and cut their tails off and toss them in the ocean and none will ever have dolphins for offspring. They'll just drown.

What makes me cringe isn't the good writing I created for the wrong causes, but rather the bad writing I now churn out for the right ones.

Welcome aboard!


Post 9

Monday, March 14, 2005 - 6:11pmSanction this postReply
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Michael says: What makes me cringe isn't the good writing I created for the wrong causes, but rather the bad writing I now churn out for the right ones.

ROFL - I think we have all been there!

George


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Post 10

Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 1:43amSanction this postReply
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Wow.  I'm tremendously appreciative and thankful for all of your responses.  I'd particularly like to thank Robert for his response.  I'd also like to thank Barbara for contributing to my first forum post.  It's a little like having the queen turn up at a housewarming.

Anyway, I agree that determining to live my present and future life rationally and objectively is the best thing I can possibly do.  Nothing I previously wrote did anyone any damage (though my book Plan Your Home With Feng Shui probably led to the shifting around of a few sofas, for which I apologise) so there isn't any earned guilt here.  However, I do think that writing a public statement of my evolution would be a good idea, so thanks to Michael for that suggestion.

I'm fortunate to have gotten here before my 35th birthday.  Leaves me plenty of time to enjoy the rest of my rational life.

(Edited by Ian Bruce on 3/15, 1:55am)

(Edited by Ian Bruce on 3/15, 1:56am)


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Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 5:17amSanction this postReply
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"Feng Shui"? So you're the S. O. B. who kept that fad going!

Ian, I take back all the nice things I said.

;^)



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Post 12

Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 7:59amSanction this postReply
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Three "Hail Mary"s should cover everything.

Post 13

Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 5:24amSanction this postReply
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Sounds like someone's got their bed on the wrong side of the room :)


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Post 14

Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 11:49amSanction this postReply
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Don't let Robert get to ya, Ian. He has his application in for the job of God...   //;-)

Michael


Post 15

Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 11:58amSanction this postReply
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Rodney,

How about three Hail Ayn's? Followed by one Hail Leonard?


Post 16

Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 12:06pmSanction this postReply
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MSK:

You got the news wrong. I've hired God on as an apprentice.

I'll interview Trump next week.

--RJB

Post 17

Tuesday, March 15, 2005 - 12:18pmSanction this postReply
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Should an objectivist repent?

In a word.... no


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Post 18

Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - 12:50amSanction this postReply
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I wouldn't hire God if I were you.  She's got one hell of a temper.

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Post 19

Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - 5:19amSanction this postReply
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Galt bless us, every one.

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