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Post 0

Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 5:22amSanction this postReply
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I am located in Bermuda, A tiny Island in the North Atlantic about 650 miles east of South Carolina.  Bermuda is a self governing United kingdom depenpent territory as a citizen I am a British subject, I am also a U.S. citizen.

Post 1

Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 7:19amSanction this postReply
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Keith,
Go to www.frappr.com and look for Objectivist Nation. Many on that map are current or former SOLOists, and other Objectivist types.


Post 2

Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 9:27amSanction this postReply
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Although I did not create this poll, it helps me as Club Coordinator to know where to focus my efforts.  So does the "Objectivist Nation" map.

Post 3

Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 9:34amSanction this postReply
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Thank you Jeff!

I'll take a look


Post 4

Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 5:43pmSanction this postReply
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I just signed up, and here is the message I got:

"Currently you do not have any friends."

Yikes.

Post 5

Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 5:59pmSanction this postReply
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Ash,
In your case, you can rest assured that is not so.


Post 6

Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 9:17pmSanction this postReply
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Definitely so, Ashley... ye got many here........;-)

Post 7

Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 11:08amSanction this postReply
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Thanks fellas, but I wasn't fishing for reassurance... I know that I have many wonderful friends. I was more amused that this is the message that shows up for all new members. I might have put "Currently, no groups have been added to your friends list," or something like that.

Post 8

Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 12:03pmSanction this postReply
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Ash,
I took your post as humor. Apparently mine was too subtle to be funny. (Or simply not funny, more likely.)

Ok, two chickens cross the road...


Post 9

Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 4:40pmSanction this postReply
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Only two?


Or are ye implying others tried but didn't make it...

(Edited by robert malcom on 12/14, 4:42pm)


Post 10

Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 10:21amSanction this postReply
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Shouldn't New Zealand be classed along with the UK and Canada as Other Europe?
Or even part of 'more like the USSR every day'?


Post 11

Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 9:39pmSanction this postReply
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    This poll indicates that Objectivists should pay more attention to those who really need to be concerned, and helped by a good philosophy, such as those living in Asia and Russia where individuals are suppr-essed. This philosophy should become less US-centered. Or else how can you be sure "or day by day it increasingly appears to be the case"
(Edited by femino on 12/16, 1:35am)


Post 12

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 6:25amSanction this postReply
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Hi Femino,

That's what activism is all about; spreading the word. The philosophy isn't U.S. centric, rather the U.S. is by far the country that offers the best examples of it in action. That's not to say that the U.S. isn't full of contradictions and problems. It's just that it's so much worse just about everywhere else. With the bulk of RoR members in the U.S. it's not suprising that much talk revolves around the U.S.. It would be great to see larger membership from other countries, especially China. Given the censorship issues, what more do you think that you and others can do to spread the word to other places, like your country?

Ethan


Post 13

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 2:01pmSanction this postReply
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I'm surprised to see no votes from South America. Is it because RoR is only english speaking or because there is less internet access? Where are the Brazilian and Argentinian and Chilian objectivists?

Post 14

Friday, December 16, 2005 - 3:23pmSanction this postReply
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They became immigrants...
(Edited by robert malcom on 12/16, 3:24pm)


Post 15

Saturday, December 17, 2005 - 6:40pmSanction this postReply
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> Objectivists should pay more attention to those who really need to be concerned, and helped by a good philosophy, such as those living in Asia and Russia where individuals are suppr-essed. This philosophy should become less US-centered. [femino]

Femino, as a student of history and where ideas are most likely to spread, I strongly agree. Really radical ideas spread where people are desperate and hungry for them not in smug, complacent, prosperous countries whose attitude is "I'm all right, Jack."

If you live in a country where you or your parents were forced to kowtow, to live as a slave, ground under an iron heel, where you are obstructed at every turn when you open your mouth, when you could go to jail or lose your job if you say the wrong thing, these ideas have enormous potential.

To not realize that other countries, even with no western tradition, are ripe for a tiny but intense and vibrant and serious Objectivist movement with more important things to worry about than personalities and Ayn Rand's sex life - were they exposed to some of the ideas - is a stunning, colossal error made by America-centric Objectivist intellectuals and think tanks.

Instead you have to prod complacent, prosperous American Objectivist rank and filers with a stick to get 'em to show a pulse with regard to activism, writing, spreading the ideas as if their lives and futures depended on it.

All those years when I was starting up and running Objectivist clubs, I never got anyone to volunteer to help. Why should they? They live a good life in a society which basically muddles through without Objectivism. They don't view it as in their self-interest to live a finger to help Objectivism.

It would be different in a less-free or less-successful country.

Post 16

Sunday, December 18, 2005 - 4:07amSanction this postReply
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Assuming that to be so - why, then, the great success of her ideas in this country, rather than in the rest of the world?

Post 17

Monday, December 19, 2005 - 8:10amSanction this postReply
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> Assuming that to be so - why, then, the great success of her ideas in this country, rather than in the rest of the world? [Robert M]

"Great" success, is over-stated compared to what is needed to change historical momentum.

She never went on college lecture tours in the rest of the world, wrote a newspaper column, appeared on their television. Plus her books were either not translated into their languages -or- are very sparsely available as opposed to an entire shelf or two in every single Border's and Barnes and Noble. Nor is there today a sustained attempt to send speakers to, start clubs in colleges across their countries. And the two activist foundations, ARI and TOC, have spent millions trying to spread her ideas almost exclusively in... guess where?.... America.

Even with that, her ideas are a lot less popular and her formal and full-fledged philosophy virtually unknown in America by 99% of the population. When most Americans are presented with her formal philosophy (as opposed to a few out of context or diluted ideas), they either don't get it or find it alien or horrible.

It is her *novels* which are popular after half a century of dissemination and availability.

Phil

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Post 18

Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 9:33amSanction this postReply
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Phil Coates wrote: "When most Americans are presented with her formal philosophy (as opposed to a few out of context or diluted ideas), they either don't get it or find it alien or horrible. It is her *novels* which are popular after half a century of dissemination and availability."

An interesting personal note: in 1966 when I was a senior in high school, my lady band director noticed my level of intelligence (such as it was; I am no genius) and decided to give me the issue of The Objectivist Newsletter with Nathaniel Branden's essay "Altruism vs. Benevolence." She apparently thought I would "get it," but I didn't. <sigh> A month or two later, as a graduation gift, she gave me Atlas Shrugged, and that time the message "took."  :-)

Another personal note: after reading several AR novels and then launching into The Virtue of Selfishness, my mother finally noticed what I was getting into and expressed some concern about all that "selfishness," and why did I need that, since I seemed to be self-centered enough, already. (This, from a woman who was trying to pressure me into pursuing the college major and career she wanted me to have!) I told her, "Mom, I'm just trying to get clear on what are my values and to have the integrity to pursue them and not give up." And she scornfully replied (I'll never forget this), "Values? Values are what you get at Sears!"

Many years later, she admitted that she was just pulling my leg (seeming to not understand the philosophical meaning of "values"), and that she was just baiting me, because she was upset about the direction I was going. She was worried about my ending up the gutter, broke and homeless, if I pursued a career as a professional musician. After 35 non-poverty-stricken years of being a musician, I think I have convinced her that my choice was not that bad of a one, after all. :-)

Best holiday wishes to all,
especially my Christian friends, :-)
REB



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