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Post 0

Tuesday, November 8, 2005 - 12:51pmSanction this postReply
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Jezus christ mother of god - I can't believe this!

Well, it's election day here. Time to go do something about this fucked up country.




Post 1

Tuesday, November 8, 2005 - 1:15pmSanction this postReply
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I can, Katherine. This sort of bullshit isn't new; the FBI was notorious for its prying under J. Edgar Hoover in the late 1950s.



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Post 2

Tuesday, November 8, 2005 - 2:22pmSanction this postReply
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Yes, and for all its public yap of otherwise, it hasn't changed a whit since.

And if hackers REALLY wanted to do something of benefit, breaking into this, and removing all within, would be the thing to do... indeed, it would be the most patriotic act one such could ever do...

(Edited by robert malcom on 11/08, 2:24pm)

(Edited by robert malcom on 11/08, 2:26pm)




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Post 3

Tuesday, November 8, 2005 - 2:40pmSanction this postReply
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First, this piece is fiction. His FBI friend disappeared afterward? Come on. He’s still fine, even posting his story on the web, but his FBI friend has been taken care of. Right.

Second, anyone taking photos of guarded facilities on 9/11/01 should be looked at and watched.

Third, there was a card under his door…so he phoned…answered questions and gave his social security number? What a dumb-ass!




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Post 4

Tuesday, November 8, 2005 - 7:23pmSanction this postReply
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Seconding Katherine Brakora, I can't believe this either.  Seconding John Letendre, I don't.  Go to Capitol Hill Blue's homepage.  This is a fringey leftist rag that plays to adolescent persecution fantasies.

Peter




Post 5

Tuesday, November 8, 2005 - 7:50pmSanction this postReply
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Silly and discredited though the source may be, Adam Reed posted it because he believed that it carried a warning.  Assuming that it does carry a warning for him, what then, of Adam Reed's claim in the "Anarcho Miniarchist" thread that governments exist to protect rights?  Why does the journalist not simply sue the FBI to make them obey the law?  (Okay, you can stop laughing now...)




Post 6

Tuesday, November 8, 2005 - 11:42pmSanction this postReply
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Michael,

Let's keep a semblance of proportionality. Being a "person of interest" is bad, but - if the actual history of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth is any guide - being imprisoned for life, on the whim of any one of several dozen guys with their own dungeons and private armies, would have been worse.




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Post 7

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 8:11amSanction this postReply
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Michael,

Privacy would go out the window under multiple agencies. With one government, at least we have a chance at limiting what can go into databases kept on us, what grounds to start one, when it must be tossed, etc. Under competing agencies, all of them would keep more extensive databases on all of us; it certainly would make sense for them to do so—if competitive, efficient police work is their business. There would be no way to stop them from doing so, or to place any limits on the practice.

Jon




Post 8

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 10:11amSanction this postReply
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Thank you Jon and Peter.



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Post 9

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 10:31amSanction this postReply
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By the way, has the FBI done anything to correct its "person of interest" designation for Steven Hatfill? Here is a link to a Mona Charen commentary on it. http://www.rense.com/general28/somethingfishy.htm

Also, during their surveillance, one of the FBI officers ran over Hatfill's foot in a parking lot and gave Hatfill a ticket for creating a walking hazard.

Jim




Post 10

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 10:49amSanction this postReply
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What's your source on the latter?  My impression is that state and local police issue tickets, not the FBI.

Peter




Post 11

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 11:17amSanction this postReply
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Peter,

Slightly different than what I remembered, but it still doesn't speak well of the FBI.
http://washingtontimes.com/national/20030815-114916-5622r.htm

Jim




Post 12

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 11:18amSanction this postReply
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Peter,

Except where the local police choose otherwise, FBI raids use a cordon of local police.




Post 13

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 11:57amSanction this postReply
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I've heard that as of 1985 or so, if you write to the FBI to ask if they have a file on you -- they open a file on you.



Post 14

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 12:08pmSanction this postReply
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Andre, they probably do that to save themselves the trouble of actually having to check to see if they have a file on you. If they open a file on anybody who asks if there's a file on them, they answer all such queries, "Yes, we have a file on you, and we know you read Playboy and write a complaint to the editor every time the magazine puts a blonde in the centerfold."



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Post 15

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 2:08pmSanction this postReply
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It is truly pathetic...but then, look at Armed Forces Radio.  On CSPAN the other night, they were discussing putting people who weren'tspeaking on behalf of Bush and his blind sheep.  The Republicans responded that in order to be on Armed Forces Radio, you had to have at least 1 million listeners and be nationally syndicated.  Randi Rhodes, Ed Shultz, and Al Franken (among others outside of the Rush Limbaugh and Dr. Ruth group) have over a million listeners and are nationally syndicated.  Funny...that doesn't seem to matter to them.  It doesn't surprise me that the FBI red-flag's dissenters...I mean, they won't even let their army be privy to the truth in news!

The sick thing about people in power abusing their authority goes right back to the story of the boy who cried wolf.  If we know that the FBI.....or the government....or those in jobs of power have been unethical in one situation (ie: red flagging those excercising their freedoms and their ability to think), then when they find a real criminal--someone who actually has cause for flagging, then what can we believe?  Even worse, how will they take care of those who are really a danger to our free living if they're so damn buzy muzzling anyone not in their little club?




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Post 16

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 3:19pmSanction this postReply
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Halina,

The author of this story we all read obviously hasn’t been muzzled.

Have his rights been violated? Has there been a violation of NIOF against him?

If I put everything my neighbors tell me about themselves into a database on my computer, is that a violation of their rights?

Jon




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Post 17

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 3:25pmSanction this postReply
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I'm with you, Jon.

Where are all the protests against private databases? I can say from personal experience that numerous credit agencies, lenders, schools, and employers have found me to be "a person of interest."

So what?

Where is the rights violation in a file folder? Where is the initiation of force in a database?

What I find evidence of here is not violations of rights, but simple hatred of government. Not the same thing, my friends. Not the same thing.



Post 18

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 4:47pmSanction this postReply
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I agree with Jon and Robert. I can only conclude that those expressing outrage on this thread disapprove of the police actions on this thread. Because it’s likely the Australian federal police used a similar database tool to identify those suspects.

 




Post 19

Wednesday, November 9, 2005 - 5:17pmSanction this postReply
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What I find evidence of here is not violations of rights, but simple hatred of government. Not the same thing, my friends. Not the same thing.

 
The usual kudos, Robert.




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