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Tuesday, March 22, 2005 - 6:18pmSanction this postReply
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Thank you for this review Luther. Personally it is very important for me to understand my mind and behavior, and perhaps control what I can to work for what I desire. When someone claims to provide answers, I am eager to listen; it strikes me that you and I are similar spirits.

Do you personally use this system? I ask because I imagine to apply so much information to practice would be painfully overwhelming and confusing. If applied consistently, every second of one's day would consist of observing one's own behavior (and breathing and posture and eye movement) as well as that of every acquaintance, then processing every bit of information to mean something else, where one then decides their next eye movements and breathing and speech. I would be tearing my hair out, let alone mirroring and pacing and creating anchors.

That being said I suppose we do this all day anyway, using learned reflex from years of experience. To be able to change the reflexes we don't want would be a true advantage indeed. Aristotle himself once said we are the sum of our habits. Could it be that humanity is as simple and malleable as this?

Honestly, I have been abused before by salesmen claiming they have answers. Self-improvement is something of climbing a mountain, I am wary of those trying to convince me that there is an elevator on the other side. I'd like to hear from others who stand by NLP and their personal experiences.



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Tuesday, March 22, 2005 - 6:52pmSanction this postReply
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Self-improvement is something of climbing a mountain, I am wary of those trying to convince me that there is an elevator on the other side
Stephen, what a great way of putting that!

Jason




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Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 5:14amSanction this postReply
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Stephen, you made an accurate observation regarding the "overwhelming" nature of NLP.  Robbins and other NLP advocates often have the bad habit of dumping a load of information into the laps of their readers and listeners without consideration for the "crow epistemology" principle.  With the help of Objectivism and its principles of induction and concept formation, I have shaken the system down to a few streamlined categories which I outlined on the initial "Ultimate Success Formula" flow chart.  That makes my employment of the NLP concepts much easier.

I use NLP to enhance my application of Objectivism, particularly in role modeling and personal emotional management.  Dry logic alone will not help me to tap into my inner strengths and passions and thus will not motivate me to identify and to achieve worthy goals.  Likewise, incidents that might infuriate me demand a temporary act of disassociation until a later time when I can cool my destructive passions and develop a master plan for effective change -- or acceptance -- of the situation.

Take a look at the SOLO Florida page, particularly the links to the articles about the "Reality Model" and the "Enhanced Tri-Quation."  Now consider some of the Roles you currently fill or want to fill.  Who would serve as excellent role models?  How will you duplicate their results?  To model them effectively using NLP requires "putting the cook in the kitchen," e.g. clearly identifying their key beliefs, mental syntax and physiology.  If they credit their success to mystical notions, you will have to do the extra work to extract the objective nuggets of wisdom from the nonsensical fluff in which they may be buried.

(Edited by Luther Setzer on 3/23, 5:25am)




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Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 6:28amSanction this postReply
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Luke, I was glad to see you raise the "crow epistemology" issue, because that was exactly my thought when I saw your post. I don't know how anyone is supposed to grasp all of that and keep it in mind in any way that is useful, moment to moment.

Much more useful would be a few simple rules -- a code -- or some memorable examples, exemplars and models.




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Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 7:17amSanction this postReply
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Robert, thanks for the comments.  I edited the review to add a section called "How To Use This Book Effectively" to include my comments about the "crow epistemology."



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Thursday, March 24, 2005 - 5:20amSanction this postReply
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Thanks for raising this subject, Luther.  I personally find NLP very useful.  Anthony Robbins has done well to present NLP principles to the general public, but he is a salesman and entertainer at heart, so his presentation of the subject is sometimes a bit overwhelming.  I attended his Unleash The Power Within seminar in London last October, and as well as walking on fire, I came away with more ideas than I knew how to deal with.  I also discovered that he talks a lot more about God than I would have liked.

Another good book on the subject of NLP is the NLP WORKBOOK by Joseph O'Connor.  This is a more systematic study of NLP and takes the reader from basic principles (the 13 Presuppositions) through to putting the various techniques together.




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