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Friday, September 14, 2007 - 12:16pmSanction this postReply
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I grabbed a copy of We The Living a few weeks ago and still have a question or two.

One: Can anyone explain to me why Kira loved Leo even after Andrei?
Two: Why after knowing, and apparently loving, Andrei she chose to go back to Leo?

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Friday, September 14, 2007 - 12:37pmSanction this postReply
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First Infatuation Trumps Grudging Respect?

I've been in three monogamous relations with none ending acrimoniously. My current boyfriend of 13 years knows that I would go back to my prior boyfriend who was murdered if I could. I would consider getting back together with my first girlfriend if my current boyfriend weren't around, but I think and hope she might have been better off in another relationship. We remained friends for a decade after we split, but she moved to the West Coast in 2000 and we haven't spoken since.

I am curious how many very good long-term relationships you have had, and if they have ended well? In Kira's case, the only hint is that she was infatuated with Leo immediately, while she had to fall for Andrei after some time. I tend to believe in loyalty to a partner. I always found Dagny's leaving Rearden for Galt improbable - or at least I wouldn't do it if I really loved Rearden and wasn't just having an affair with a good friend. Galt was too much of a non-entity for me since he only appears openly in the end of the book. He is more of a faceless disembodied voice than a flesh and blood man. Rand was thinking of him the whole time she wrote the book, so to her he was real. But as readers, he was kept a surprise and an anti-climax so far as I'm concerned.

There are also other factors. Leo may have smelled better. The sex may have been better. She most likely saw Andrei as tragically compromised. She had the boat-flight in common with Leo. Since the book is just a book, all this is speculation. The only way to answer the question in the real world is to live it out.

Ted Keer

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Friday, September 14, 2007 - 12:52pmSanction this postReply
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I've had only two very serious relationships in my short life. My first wife and I didn't get along and all and I assume she is glad to be rid of me. I wouldn't exchange wife two for wife one in a million years. That part of my life seems to anger me mostly.

I felt the same way about Dagny and Rearden. While I was very excited to lean of Galt I was a little surprised that she would jettison Rearden. I guess, though, he was still married and Galt was the 'better' man.

Now let me ask you this: Was Kira's affair with Andrei moral?

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Friday, September 14, 2007 - 1:03pmSanction this postReply
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Airtight

There are two major types of affairs, flings that your lover doesn't find out about, and affairs that end the marriage. This case was unusual because she was using Andrei before she came to love him. But Kira didn't go into it with any pretenses, and Andrei also knew she was involved. Kira should have expected the possibility that Leo might leave her. Andrei should have expected the same. I think Kira was taking a calculated risk for which she was willing to suffer the consequences. My motto is, "If it's worth the time, commit the crime." I think she had reasonable cause to believe that she was doing the best possible under the circumstances.

Also, keep in mind that the working title was Airtight and the theme was the impossibility of individual happiness under a dictatorship. Rand wrote the book so that none would end up perfectly happy.

Ted Keer

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Friday, September 14, 2007 - 1:09pmSanction this postReply
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So, is it possible that Leo just couldn't handle living life in Soviet Russia?

I disagree with you about Andrei knowing Kira was in a relationship. I seem to remember that he was very shocked when he found out that she and Leo were an actual item.

As for having affairs I will say this, I had an affair, two actually, while I was married to my first wife. I was very glad she found out about the second, it set me free. As for the first, I would be mortified if she ever knew, even now.
(Edited by Steve on 9/14, 1:32pm)


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Friday, September 14, 2007 - 1:15pmSanction this postReply
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BTW, If you haven't seen the movie, it is worth obtaining at all costs. The title is Noi Vivi (also under We the Living) staring a young Alida Valli as well as Rossano Brazzi, both of whom had long film careers in Europe and the US. This is one of the best movies ever made and is much better than the cramped The Fountainhead production.

Ted Keer

Here is pictured Valli with Joseph Cotton in 1949's The Third Man.

Post 6

Friday, September 14, 2007 - 1:25pmSanction this postReply
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That photo reminds me of a chat I had the other day with a friend. We were talking of beautiful women and I admitted that there are not many around now, as far as I am concerned. I want to see more women like that.

Post 7

Friday, September 14, 2007 - 2:01pmSanction this postReply
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Then I command you to immediately rent Gilda, The Lady from Shanghai, The Third Man, and the 1939's Hunchback of Notre Dame
with


Hayworth, Valli, O'Hara - and none of the pictures does the women justice in live motion.

(Edited by Ted Keer on 9/14, 2:33pm)


Post 8

Friday, September 14, 2007 - 2:04pmSanction this postReply
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I'll never forget Jane Russell from The Outlaw. God, I love her hair.

That Photo of Rita Hayworth....I can't even describe what I like about it. Thats why I like sculpture, especially of human figures.
(Edited by Steve on 9/14, 2:09pm)


Post 9

Friday, September 14, 2007 - 2:42pmSanction this postReply
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Romeo is Bleeding

I think Lena Olin is one of the most beautiful of women, again much more sensual live than in still. In "Romeo is Bleeding" she plays a one-armed Russian Mafia Assassin against Gary Oldman as a corrupt NYC cop in one of the most violent yet sensual femme fatale roles ever acted. I recommend everyone rent that movie. The movie is brutal, but if you can stomach it, most worth watching.



(Edited by Ted Keer on 9/14, 2:55pm)


Post 10

Friday, September 14, 2007 - 2:48pmSanction this postReply
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Hayworth's high cheek bones, strong jaw line, full lips, perfect symmetry, trademark hair and "fertility indicators" as well as her athletic ability and wonderful voice all make her the sex goddess.



(Edited by Ted Keer on 9/14, 2:51pm)


Post 11

Saturday, September 15, 2007 - 3:05pmSanction this postReply
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Speaking of the Divas, Steve, check out these upcoming airings of Hayworth and others. Hayworth will also be on TCM this Friday in Gilda.

Post 12

Saturday, September 15, 2007 - 7:12pmSanction this postReply
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Unfortunately, I'll be on the road.

Post 13

Saturday, September 15, 2007 - 8:35pmSanction this postReply
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Thought that was a possibility, but if you have cable you should consider getting a DVR.



Post 14

Saturday, September 15, 2007 - 10:20pmSanction this postReply
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Or, instead of a DVR, I could get a job where I'm home more. I thought driving a truck would be good for me because I was tired of dealing with people. I've found that being alone, totally alone, is not as romantic as I assumed.

Thinking is one thing I have plenty of time for now, however I miss reading and desperately miss writing. Those were my two emotional outlets. Now I find myself crying, yes crying, over commercials and silly love songs playing on the radio.

And now I'm leaving again for another few weeks...

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Sunday, September 16, 2007 - 10:26amSanction this postReply
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"crying, over commercials and silly love songs playing on the radio."

What's wrong with that? I'd like to know...

Even if you settle down you'll still want a DVR.

Crying over good things is a blessing, the chances it's a brain tumor are negligible. Most people don't cry over silly love songs because they committed psychological suicide in high school.

Ted

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Sunday, November 22 - 12:51pmSanction this postReply
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The bridge shown in this link is the Dvortsovy, shown in construction (1912-1916) in this drawing by Anna Petrovna Ostroumova-Lebedeva. 

 

I’ve surmised that Kira’s scene of first lovemaking in Rand’s novel We the Living was under this bridge on the frozen Neva at Petrograd (now St. Petersburg) in post-revolutionary Russia, in the early 1920’s. That setting coincides with the years Rand was still in college there.



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Sunday, November 22 - 1:22pmSanction this postReply
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In We the Living (1936), the reader learns of heroine Kira that she “was born in the gray granite house on Kamenostrovsky. In that vast mansion Galina Petrovna [Kira’s mother] had a boudoir where, at night, a maid in black fastened the clasps of her diamond necklaces; and a reception room where, her taffeta petticoats rustling solemnly, she entertained ladies with sables and lorgnettes. . . . / Kira had an English governess, a thoughtful young lady with a lovely smile. She liked her governess, but often preferred to be alone—and was left alone. . . . / . . . The first thing that Kira learned about life and the first thing that her elders learned, dismayed, about Kira, was the joy of being alone” (36–37).

 

At eighteen the eyes of Kira “looked at people quietly, directly, with something that people called arrogance, but which was only a deep, confident calm that seemed to tell men her sight was too clear and none of their favorite binoculars were needed to help her look at life” (35).

 

That a conception of a new nobility, for the modern age, should include the traits of being a self-starter and having a self-sufficient disposition is agreed by Nietzsche and Rand. Nietzsche writes in The Gay Science (1882):

The Ultimate Noblemindedness – So what makes a person ‘noble’? Certainly not making sacrifices; even those burning with lust make sacrifices. Certainly not following some passion, for there are contemptible passions. Certainly not that one does something for others without selfishness: perhaps no one is more consistently selfish than the noble one. – Rather, the passion that overcomes the noble one is a singularity, and he fails to realize this: the use of a rare and singular standard and almost a madness; the feeling of heat in things that feel cold to everyone else; a hitting upon values for which the scale has not yet been invented; a sacrifice on altars for an unknown god; a courage without any desire for honors; a self-sufficiency that overflows and communicates to men and things.” (55)

 

Rand’s Kira is one who feels the heat in things that feel cold to everyone else. 

“She stopped suddenly, as they walked down a street in the evening, and pointed to a strange angle of white wall over battered roofs, luminous on a black sky in the glare of an old lantern, with a dark, barred window like that of a dungeon, and she whispered “How beautiful!”. . . . / . . . She had the same feeling for white statues of ancient gods against black velvet in museums, and for steel shavings and rusty dust and hissing torches and muscles tense as electric wires in the iron roar of a building under construction.” (38–39)



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Sunday, November 22 - 1:24pmSanction this postReply
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In 1922 after five years of revolution and civil war, the Argounova family in We the Living returns from the Crimea to Petrograd in a boxcar. In all the mud, fear, crudeness, and destitution of this city in those days, Kira Argounova, age 18, returns to Rand’s fond city, with the thought “Isn’t it wonderful!” (WL 23). She is wearing homemade wooden sandals. She smiles at the greeting of an old friend, the bell of a tram outside the station and smiles at the adventure of life before her. At the train station exit door, there is a poster with welcoming words above a rising sun, “Comrades! We are the builders of a new life!” (WL 22).

 

As a child, Kira had read a story about a conquering Viking who respects neither throne nor altar. This story was Kira’s favorite, high above all others. This conqueror is never defeated. At the end of the story, looking over a city he had conquered, the Viking raises a goblet of wine and speaks: “To life, which is a reason unto itself” (40–41).

 

Kira had entered life, not with head bowed in religious awe, nor with “a cold skin crying for the warmth of the herd. Kira Argounova entered it with the sword of a Viking pointing the way . . .” (WL 42–43). The sword-point of the Viking in the childhood story is the point to which he looks no farther, “but there was no boundary for the point of his sword” (WL 40). 

 

Kira did not aspire to be a Viking, though the line of her mouth when silent “was cold, indomitable, and men thought of a Valkyrie with lance and winged helmet in the sweep of battle” (WL 36). She did not aspire to be a warrior or Valkyrie; neither did she aspire to a “life of discipline and hard work and useful labor for the great collective” (WL 37).

 

“From somewhere in the aristocratic Middle Ages, Kira had inherited the conviction that labor and effort were ignoble” (WL 41). She made good grades, but she would not learn to cook or darn. She balked at piano exercises, but chose for her future “the hardest work and most demanding effort. She was to be an engineer” (WL 41). Over Kira’s bed was the picture of an American skyscraper. She imagined she would build houses of glass and steel, a white bridge of aluminum. She imagined “men and wheels and cranes under her orders, about a sunrise on the steel skeleton of a skyscraper” (WL 41). 

 

“She knew she had a life and that it was her life. She knew the work which she had chosen and which she expected of life” (WL 41). And she worshipped and expected joy (WL 41–42).

 

When Rand first began working on this novel in 1929, its title was to be Airtight: A Novel of Red Russia. Clearly, one of the objectives of her novel was to exhibit the moral, economic, and technological inferiority of communist Russia in comparison to America and Europe. The main writing and rewriting of the novel was in 1933–35. By 1933 America was at the depth of its greatest economic depression. There was much clamoring from business and labor leaders for “economic democracy,” for the cartelization and socialization of major industries, and for central planning of production and consumption.

 

The picture of communist Russia that Rand was exposing in We the Living was as in the early 20’s. By the 30’s Russia was not Russia in the immediate aftermath of revolution and civil war. There were large construction projects underway over there, which were being touted by Stalin’s government to show the superiority of communism. 

 

A scene in Rand’s novel retained through her first couple of drafts to May 1934 was one in which Kira’s lover Leo mentions to her that in New York there are six million inhabitants and that they have subways. “It must be delightful—a subway” Leo remarks to Kira who adores such things (Milgram 2004, 13). That was cut from the novel by November 1935. There are additional reasons for removing the passage, but I think one was that Stalin’s Russia had completed its first underground metro, in Moscow, in May 1935. Rand’s use of the lack of subways in cities of communist Russia as illustration of its technical stagnation would not have been effective by 1935.

 

The adoration of big cities and their technological advancement by Kira and her creator was at odds with Nietzsche. “In the desert the truthful have always dwelled, the free spirits, as the rulers of the desert; but in the cities dwell the well-fed, famous wise men—the draft animals” (Z II “On the Famous Wise Men”). “‘Oh Zarathustra, this is the big city: here you have nothing to gain and everything to lose’. / . . . . / [Zarathustra] looked at the big city, sighed, and kept silent for a long time. Finally he spoke thus: “‘I am nauseated too by the big city . . . . Here . . . nothing can be bettered, nothing can be worsened’” (Z III “On Passing By”).

 

In her love of city and technology, Rand would not find a kindred spirit in Nietzsche. Strikingly different between Nietzsche and Rand are the central objects of human creativity. Nietzsche’s foci are on creation in the arts, in philosophy, and in one’s own character. His lack of appreciation of creativity in technological realms always amazed me (okay, appalled me).

 

Nietzsche thought one desirable circumstance of aristocracy their “freedom from deadening labor.” Having to labor is nothing of which to be proud if one is aristocratic in nature. Similarly, Kira is introduced as a girl who does not perform menial work such as cooking and darning. Partly that trait is a contribution to setting the character Kira apart from women keeping to traditional, less-ambitious social roles. Mainly it is to set Kira above all who perform menial labor, to set her as of some sort of aristocratic spirit.

 

In Nietzsche’s view, only aristocratic society has ever advanced the type man. Such a society

“believes in a long ladder of rank order and value distinctions between men and in some sense needs slavery. Without the pathos of distance as it grows out of the ingrained differences between stations, out of the way the ruling caste maintains an overview and keeps looking down on subservient types and tools, and out of this caste’s equally continuous exercise in obeying and commanding, in keeping away and below—without this pathos, that other, more mysterious pathos could not have grown at all, that demand for new expansions of distance within the soul itself, the development of states that are increasingly high, rare, distant, tautly drawn and comprehensive, and in short, the enhancement of the type “man,” the constant “self-overcoming of man” . . . . (BGE 257)”

 

Rand’s Kira does not look at the workers who would build her skyscrapers and bridges as subservient types; she sees them simply as carrying out her orders. She does not look down on the building trades. Kira’s author gives no indication of agreeing with Nietzsche’s view that the importance of allowing the existence of individuals aristocratic in spirit is to improve the type man by self-overcomings in the souls of such men.

 

Nietzsche writes that a good and healthy aristocracy does not feel that it is a function serving the state or community (BGE 258). Kira and her author certainly agreed with that. But Rand’s Kira would not squarely concur when Nietzsche writes that it is right for there to be “sacrifice of countless people who have to be pushed down and shrunk into incomplete human beings, into slaves, into tools, all for the sake of the aristocracy” (BGE 258). She would not accept that society should exist “only as the substructure and framework for raising an exceptional type of being up to its higher duty and to a higher state of being” (BGE 258). Rand in We the Living adores Petrograd and the man who ordered its creation, but she does not adore it because it gave that man a higher state of being. Kira simply values great creations and their creators. She values the man-made, the making, and the makers, to the purpose of life and joy.



Post 19

Sunday, November 22 - 1:27pmSanction this postReply
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It is clear early in We the Living that Kira and her author stand in favor of much that the Marxists refer to as “bourgeois.” We often associate the bourgeois with the Epicurean, and that Kira is not. She takes scant notice that “the voice of the flesh cries, ‘Keep me from hunger, thirst, and cold!’” (VS 33). She does not take avoidance of pain as the right limit of pleasure and desire (PD 3, 11). Her appetite for life is great. “If one loses that appetite, why still sit at the table” (WL 55). She is no dray horse, but a racing steed (WL 32).

 

With her hungry family, sharing their single wick of light, or standing in line for bread ration, Kira’s mind is fixed on her textbooks, particularly on her mathematics problems. At the Petrograd Technological Institute, where she is a first-year student, she does not pay attention to lectures of Bolshevik propaganda.

 

A student politician on the Communist side tries to enlist Kira in a Marxist Circle for young students “‘to learn the proper proletarian ideology, which we’ll all need when we go out into the world to serve the Proletarian State, since that’s what we’re all studying for, isn’t it?’ / ‘Did it ever occur to you’, asked Kira, ‘that I may be here for the very unusual, unnatural reason of wanting to learn a work I like only because I like it?’” (WL 61).

 

In her 1938 novella Anthem, set in a fictitious collectivist community (smaller and simpler than Kira’s historical setting), Rand has her protagonist Equality 7-2521 dare to choose, in the secrecy of his own mind, work he hopes to do when leaving the Home of the Students. He loves the Science of Things. He hopes he will be selected to be a scholar, but the authorities appoint him to be a street sweeper. The technology of his isolated community is very primitive in comparison to an earlier lost civilization. His people have candles, but not electricity. He discovers a subway tunnel from the ancient civilization, and he begins to experiment with electricity in secret at night. In his own community, each refers to himself as we. Of his secret work, he thinks: “We alone, of the thousands who walk this earth, we alone in this hour are doing a work which has no purpose save that we wish to do it.” In his love of the science of things, he is similar to Kira (and later, Roark and Galt); he is similar to her also in her “wanting to learn a work I like only because I like it;” and he is similar to her in standing against society made collectivist.

 

Kira is drawn into a student assembly for student elections. A speech from a student Party member barking the right purpose of the Technological Institute concludes: “‘We have outgrown the old bourgeois prejudice about the objective impartiality of science. Science is not impartial. Science is a weapon in the class struggle. We’re not here to further our own petty personal ambitions. We have outgrown the slobbering egoism of the bourgeois who whined for a personal career’”(WL 62; see Josephson 1991, 42, 51–56, 66–67, 77, 86–87, 97, 100, 184–202; Graham 1993, 88–93).

 

Where is Nietzsche on science in relation to the Red view and Kira’s “bourgeois” view? He would stand apart from either.

 

“Why do we even assume that ‘true’ and ‘false’ are intrinsically opposed? Isn’t it enough to assume that there are levels of appearance and, as it were, lighter and darker shades and tones of appearance – different valeurs, to use the language of the painters? Why shouldn’t the world that is relevant to us – be a fiction?” (BGE 34). Nietzsche would be hearing a theme and language close to his own in the words of the Red speech-maker, for Nietzsche writes that belief in “immediate certainties”—such as space, time, form, motion, and consciousness itself—is “a stupidity that does us little credit! In bourgeois life, a suspicious disposition might be a sign of ‘bad character’ and consequently considered unwise. But here with us beyond the bourgeois sphere with its Yeses and Noes, – what is to stop us from being unwise [?] . . .” (34; see also 15). Early Rand, not only late Rand, clearly rejected this radical relativism of Nietzsche.

 

Nietzsche held “it is no more than a moral prejudice that the truth is worth more than appearance” (BGE 34). We have seen in Part 1 that Nietzsche rejected Kant’s concept of the thing in itself (BGE 2, 16). There is no indication in early Rand that she accepted the Kantian idea that things in themselves are unknowable. In that she was in tune with Nietzsche. But Rand accepted that we can know things as they stand independently of our knowing them. She did not buy Nietzsche’s entire package against the idea of things as they are in themselves.

 

In the 1936 version of We the Living, Rand has a line to display the type of mind and interests of protagonist Leo, who is Kira’s beloved. “When his young friends related, in whispers, the latest French stories, Leo quoted Kant and Nietzsche.” This line is included in Robert Mayhew’s study “We the Living: ’36 and ’59” (2004, 192). In the 1959 edit, Rand replaced Kant with Spinoza in this line (WL 127). Dr. Mayhew naturally is struck by the clear indication that Rand did not hold her well-known antipathy to Kant in her early years. 

 

I wonder if Rand was not very familiar with Spinoza in her early years, and had she been familiar with him, would have used him instead of Kant. She would have known a smidgen of Spinoza simply from Nietzsche’s BGE. Certainly she would have noticed Nietzsche’s opposition to Kant’s theoretical and practical philosophy. Naturally, one wonders why she did not use Aristotle in Leo’s line in ’36 or in ’59. Perhaps because there is a level of difficulty and sustained, rarified thought widely recognized to be found in Kant and Spinoza, but not so widely associated with Aristotle. She wanted to contrast the shallowness of surrounding people with the serious mind and inner life of Leo, an inner life far away from the crush of the Red boot on their society. Then again, perhaps she used Spinoza rather than Aristotle because the latter is not so strongly egoist in ethics as the former; the polis looms large in the ethics of Aristotle. Another possibility would be that in ’36 her knowledge of Aristotle was significantly less than her knowledge of Spinoza, and that in ’59 she wanted to keep to that knowledge context within which she had created the novel in ’36.

 

Rand’s use of Kant in her original 1936 version does not necessarily signal absence of serious disagreement with Kant at that time, but it surely does indicate an intensification of her contempt for Kant’s ideas as she learned more through the years. By the time of the reissue, in revision, Rand regarded Kant’s as the antipode of her philosophy in every fundamental. Under her later assessment of Kant’s system, she would not have used him in the line about Leo, however shy of perfection she took to be the character Leo in his original, undefeated state.



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